Schickel vs. Altman

[RathBandu]

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment...,2690542.story

Not surprising, because Schickel is very old school and has lost his mind as of late (Michael Clayton as the best film of 2007? Really?), but the ferocity of his attacks are pretty mind-blowing. I knew that we were due for an Altman reappraisal one of these days, now that he's died, but Schickel is full of crap.

[Mangy]

Ridiculous.

His ability to ingest industrial-strength quantities of stuff that was bad for him fills one with shock, awe and questions.

Schickel is surprised that a filmmaker had a high drug intake? Huh?

It seems his primary complaint about Altman was that he was too flawed and unique, yet at the same time he considers Altman's individuality a "rebel pose." Dumb, dumb, dumb.

[Alan "Nordling" Cerny]

How could anyone say

Originally Posted by Richard Schickel

Misanthropy -- with a strong admixture of misogyny -- essentially substitutes for ideas in his movies and his characters are, in effect, characterless. They wander about fecklessly, striking solipsistic, but rarely authentically rebellious, poses and almost never getting into dramatically gripping conflicts.

Has he even seen GOSFORD PARK?

There's a line from THE COMMITMENTS about how soul song solos (say that three times fast) have corners but that jazz solos spiral. Well, Altman was big on spiraling. Nothing wrong with that if it makes interesting films. I'm not the biggest Altman fan in the world, but to claim what Schickel does is idiotic at best and genuinely insulting to film appreciators everywhere at worst.

[Phil]

Ebert tweeted this as "Richard Shickel's drive-by character assassination of Robert Altman"

[Fat Elvis]

There was a particular viciousness in the way he treated Hot Lips. I never found her humiliation funny.

[Alan "Nordling" Cerny]

Originally Posted by Fat Elvis

There was a particular viciousness in the way he treated Hot Lips. I never found her humiliation funny.

I can get that, but would you say that what happens to her in M*A*S*H isn't out of character for those characters or the film? It may be cruel, but in the film it makes sense.

[Phil]

I forget whose review of The Player this was (a director, I think), but "The Player is great because he shows you the tits you don't wanna see, but not the tits you DO wanna see."

[Felt Pelt]

Schnickel has been reacting angrily and incomprehensibly to some interesting films over the last decade or so.

Even if he doesn't like Altman (who, by the standards of the article, "only" directed MASH, McCabe, Nashville, and California Split, and everything else is forgettable), you have to admit he's influential. Short Cuts and other sprawling character associations influenced PT Anderson in Boogie Nights and Magnolia, which gave birth to the huge crop of bad dramatic indie films with interconnected casts. And stuff like 28 Grams and so forth.

The Long Goodbye is amazing. Tanner '88 usually gets some respect. Probably due to Jennifer Jason Leigh and the sequence about Blue Green, I have a soft spot for Kansas City. Maybe Schnickel has run with a crowd that praises Altman to the skies, and are in denial about failures like Gosford or Gingerbread.

[Z.Vasquez]

Originally Posted by Felt Pelt

Schnickel has been reacting angrily and incomprehensibly to some interesting films over the last decade or so.

Even if he doesn't like Altman (who, by the standards of the article, "only" directed MASH, McCabe, Nashville, and California Split, and everything else is forgettable), you have to admit he's influential. Short Cuts and other sprawling character associations influenced PT Anderson in Boogie Nights and Magnolia, which gave birth to the huge crop of bad dramatic indie films with interconnected casts. And stuff like 28 Grams and so forth.

The Long Goodbye is amazing. Tanner '88 usually gets some respect. Probably due to Jennifer Jason Leigh and the sequence about Blue Green, I have a soft spot for Kansas City. Maybe Schnickel has run with a crowd that praises Altman to the skies, and are in denial about failures like Gosford or Gingerbread.

I can see Gosford not being someones cup of tea, but you'd really call it a failure?

Also, while we're praising the man= Secret Honor might be my favorite thing he's ever done. But I am a Nixon fanatic.

[Felt Pelt]

Alright, I'll say not my cup of tea.

[Z.Vasquez]

Fair enough. I kind of feel the same way about it as Prairie Home Companion, even for Altman they tend to drag. But GP's cast is just so good.

[machiav]

Originally Posted by Phil

I forget whose review of The Player this was (a director, I think), but "The Player is great because he shows you the tits you don't wanna see, but not the tits you DO wanna see."

I believe Paul Newman told Altman that after a screening.

[Parker]

Originally Posted by Fat Elvis

There was a particular viciousness in the way he treated Hot Lips. I never found her humiliation funny.

Read what Pauline Kael has to say about that in her review and you might look at it another way.

What a crock of shit this article is.

[Mangy]

Jim Emerson's excellent response:

Schickel's baseless assumption is that Altman's approach to filmmaking made him a bad director -- when his unconventional methods were elaborately designed to create just the effects you see on the screen. Altman's films offer a means of experiencing the world, a way of experiencing movies, that's instantly identifiable as his own. Schickel doesn't like it, he can turn away from it, but the fact of it is undeniable, whether Schickel can see it or not.

The Alan Rudolph letter is fantastic.

[Malmordo]

Originally Posted by Parker

Read what Pauline Kael has to say about that in her review and you might look at it another way.

Kael wasn't above character assassination if she felt a particular filmmaker had snubbed her. And she was a fawning sycophant around Altman.

[Parker]

Her character assassinations, whether you agreed with them or not, were grounded in actual ideas. She had arguments that generated out of the films themselves...which is a little more engaging then saying "Altman drank and smoked a lot and was silly so why do we take his movies seriously?"

And whether she was a fawning sycophant or not, her reasoning for defending the treatment of Hot Lips in MASH as something other than misogyny is thought out, articulate and makes perfect sense.

[Malmordo]

Originally Posted by Parker

...which is a little more engaging then saying "Altman drank and smoked a lot and was silly so why do we take his movies seriously?"

Is that what Schickel is arguing here? I don’t think so. I think he's arguing that Altman was a shallow poseur whose addictive personality and hostility to writers and studio execs can't be justified by any great talent or insight.

[Nicholas]

Originally Posted by Parker

Read what Pauline Kael has to say about that in her review and you might look at it another way.

Does anyone happen to know where a copy of her review can be found online?
I once came across a nice website filled with just her reviews but I can't seem to find it anymore.

[Michael Shaver]

Originally Posted by Nicholas

Does anyone happen to know where a copy of her review can be found online?
I once came across a nice website filled with just her reviews but I can't seem to find it anymore.

I only found this: http://sarcasmalley.com/mashrev.htm#Kael

[Nicholas]

Thanks, Michael!

[Parker]

Originally Posted by Malmordo

Is that what Schickel is arguing here? I don’t think so. I think he's arguing that Altman was a shallow poseur whose addictive personality and hostility to writers and studio execs can't be justified by any great talent or insight.

Well, if that's what he's arguing, I'd say he's doing a pretty poor job of it.