CHUD CITY - Location, Location, Location

[Hastur]

So, we are going to make a city. Where do we put it?

Personally, I like the idea of somewhere vaguely Western/Mid-Western, so that it has all kinds of seasons, but can be really hot or cold. And, I really like the idea of never mentioning where it really is.

In addition, river(s) and/or a railroad should be a part of the Geography, not a landmark. The tunnel that the railroad goes through is a landmark (if we have a tunnel), but the railroad itself is a part of the geography. This will open up a lot more possibilities for good storytelling.

Any thoughts?

[Rath/Brendan]

My only thoughts are that it should have a big ass river/lake with an island in the middle of it. (And that should be its name, too. Big-Ass River)

I think if we don't want to go the midwestern route, an island off the coast of the carolinas would be nice. You know, like a tourist haven. Only the tourists...don't come back.

::dramatic music::

[Coyote]

Posted by Rath on another thread, quoting me:
Here are some other topics for suggestion, as recommened by Old Man Coyote. Nice job.

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*Do we want mild climate, or extreme weather?
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I like hot in the summer, freezing in the winter.

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*How did commerce shape the town, conveyance-wise? Railroad? River? Lake? Port? (My suggestion...railroad yes, and make it a rivertown, with one side of the river being the lower income side, the more dangerous side...from a human standpoint, anyways.)

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Nice. Kind of cliched though, you know, the wrong side of the tracks, things like that. River town lends itself naturally to things like abandoned amusement parks, etc.

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* Do we want more of a frontier feel to it (even though the west was settled long ago, many areas still have that frontier feel to them), or a cozy hollow feel to it?

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I don't know, but I think the town should evoke some sort of emotion pertaining to "a small town in the summer time", kind of like Derry in It.

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It's a cliche because rivertowns tend to start on one side of it, then either expand on the other side, so the original got worn down as the new side gets built up, or the undesirables get shunt across the river itself to set up shop away from the "respectables."
Sometimes, cliches are good, if there are reasons for them.

Hastur, her creature, and I were discussing this while she was power posting...NE New Mexico may be the perfect place, where the moutains start. You have multiple climates, moutains, a desert close by, and both the cozy town feeling and frontier feeling at the same time.
Opinions?
(This would be about an hour or so NE of Albequerque, if anyone needs a reference. West is desert/plains, south is a weird Tundra looking area, even in the summer heat, , east and north are more moutains and forest.)
Note: We shouldn't rely too much on trying to find an exact place. In otherwords, say we go with a location, and there's no river. We want to add one. Ok. Add one.

("Big-Ass River," huh? Is that like Bad Ass, which has a Place Where The Sun Doesn't Shine in the Ramtop Mountains?)

[Richard Dickson]

As I wrote elsewhere:

"I think we shouldn't be too specific about place. Just leave it as this sort of Everytown that could be anywhere, kind of like Springfield on The Simpsons."

[Coyote]

...which we'll do by not actually naming the state publically, but for internal consistancy, we have to agree on the geography. Since NE New Mexico has a wonderful mix of things, that became the suggestion.

If we don't figure out a place for the writers, we get a character trudging through the tropics in one story, starving on a flat plain the next, and falling through the ice in another, all in the same trip to the corner store to get cigarettes.

[Richard Dickson]

I have no problem establishing geography and climate. I'd just rather not pin it down to a specific state.

[Dan Whitehead]

Obviously, I think it should be a miserable industrial town in the North of England. But that's purely because I have no idea what NE New Mexico looks like. :p

I think it'd be better to come up with existing examples of fictional towns with the right "feel" and start from there. Derry from "IT" is a great starting point, as are most of King's towns. We should be going for the mood and personality of the town rather than geography, in my opinion. The town should become like another character, not just a backdrop.

[Coyote]

"Obviously, I think it should be a miserable industrial town in the North of England."

Actually, I would rather have it be Manchester than another Stephen King clone.

For one thing, it's much easier for many people to research a place they've never been (as a reference for the feel, only) than to sit through a Stephen King novel.

Seriously, though...that's WHY we're working on the geography first, so the town can develop a cohesive personality. We're not talking cartography, which is saying this is HERE, and this is THERE, etc, we're talking about features that comprise the very basics...the support structure this gestalt project can stand on.
Without it, we've got some people writing about an island, others writing about a town with tumbleweeds, and others writing about Mainers.

I'd prefer the town develop a personality from a thoughtful upbringing, rather than a personality disorder from neglect.

[Rath/Brendan]

I think a river is nice. And the mountains are cool too, especially if the river runs through them. Cliffs and rapids would be cool. And parks, and forests.

All this stuff, of course, would be on the outer edges of the township.

[Coyote]

With the sawmill being pwered by an upstream waterwheel on a cliff-face just outside of town. wink

Hmmm...possibly said cliff-face be a nice little waterfall a few stories high. That would mean that this town would be the last stop on the river (going up), though, since the boats couldn't exactly scale the waterfall. Not that there's anything wrong with that...it may be a bonus. The end of the line.

[Rath/Brendan]

Here's my proposal:

The town plan should resemble something like Hill Valley in BTTF. There should be a central landmark, such as a courthouse or mayor's office or even a big ass statue of Uncle Mitch that serves as the town square. It doesn't have to be small, you could even put a nice park (for festivals and carnivals wink, wink, nudge nudge) around it.

The square should be surrounded by a circular road with points coming off of it at 12 o clock, 2, 4, 6, 8, and 10. The 12 o clock line is the dividing marker between the rich, new, trendy area, home of the corporations and the chemical plants (so roads 8 and 10). This is the older part of town, so you that's where you find your creepy old houses and things like that.

Roads 2 and 4 are the working class side, and that's where you find your abandoned waterfronts and railroads, etc. That all leads out towards the wooded, river bank area.

The twelve/six o clock line is your main street, and that's where you find your shops, your libraries, your bars, etc.

Geographically, the richer side of town rises up above the rest of the town so the roads leading towards that area curve up. This is the mountainous, cliffy area.

As for history, I propose that it's an old mining/riverfront town in which the miners (i.e, the poor sections) were eventually driven out of buisness by the big corporations (i.e, the rich sections). But that's me.

[Rath/Brendan]

Old Man Coyote:
With the sawmill being pwered by an upstream waterwheel on a cliff-face just outside of town. wink

Hmmm...possibly said cliff-face be a nice little waterfall a few stories high. That would mean that this town would be the last stop on the river (going up), though, since the boats couldn't exactly scale the waterfall. Not that there's anything wrong with that...it may be a bonus. The end of the line.This is a nice idea, although I was thinking, what about mines? You know, under the cliffs where on the rich people's side (see above). The railroad can start there and wind its way through the outskirts towards the river.

Plus mines lend themselves to people getting lost in them or things coming out of them. Or secret tunnels for cults.

[Rath/Brendan]

Speaking of secret cult tunnels, here's a story Carl Cunningham told in the urban legends thread in the Creature Corner. I think something like this would be very nice, and make a great little story. It has fired off the synapses for me...

Originally posted by Carl Cunningham: <strong>
Satan's Triangle. Legend has it, that there is a system of underground caverns and tunnels running throughout underneath Kennesaw, Georgia. It used to be a very rural area, but it's gangbusters now. Huge malls, movie theaters, restraunts, multi-million dollar apartment complexes... it's now totally urbanized thanks to the sprawl of Atlanta's growth.

Anyway, so the legend goes... A satanic cult has existed in the area for many years, going back before the time of the civil war. Supposedly, the bodies of sacrificial victims (who have never been found) are hidden somewhere within the triangle in the underground catacombs. There are supposedly 3 secret entrances to the tunnel system. One is said to be near Town Center Mall, one near historic Kennesaw's railroad tracks, and one off of White Circle Road near a Satanic Church (which does in fact exist).

Most likely bullshit and pure local folklore. But, it's still a cool story. What makes it interesting is that you hear stories from many different types of people, including cops who swear that at least some of it is true. Who knows. All I know is that weird stuff has happened in this area since I've lived here over the past 24 years or so. Could be because this place was once sacred Cherokee Indian burial ground... and was also the site of one of the bloodiest battles of the Civil War.

Oh, one more thing... White Circle Road. To this day, police road blocks prevent people from driving on the road at night for a visit to the church. Very nice...

[Coyote]

My suggestion? Change the cult from Satanists to something like an Old Ones cult. More interesting, more tentacles, etc. Satanists are more vanilla now than some of the things the Catholic Church are coming up with.

[Rath/Brendan]

Old Man Coyote:
My suggestion? Change the cult from Satanists to something like an Old Ones cult.Oooh...

That's nice. Very nice. I was watching Temple of Doom today and thought that a Kali cult would also be a nice idea. Very freaky. Only problem is, how are you going to import a Kali cult to the American West?

[Dan Whitehead]

RathBandu 2.0:
That's nice. Very nice. I was watching Temple of Doom today and thought that a Kali cult would also be a nice idea. Very freaky. Only problem is, how are you going to import a Kali cult to the American West?Cheap railroad labour brought a lot of new cultures to America. Mostly Chinese admittedly, but who's to say?

I'm sure we could work in some creepy pagan Wicker Man type cults brought over by the English pre-Civil War, in the Salem Witch Trials era.

[Rath/Brendan]

That's it. That's my first "historical document"! (Most of my stories for this project will be in the forms of historical papers/news clippings/etc. For a guide, see Mike Hanlon's History of Derry in "It")