HOW MANY TIMES CAN DEVIN BE WRONG ABOUT THE DARK KNIGHT?
- By Devin Faraci
- Published 11/25/2008
- News

It takes a big man to admit that he's wrong, and many of our delightful, anonymous commenters will be happy to tell you that I am, in fact, a big man. So here I am, eating some crow about The Dark Knight.
First I said that the film wouldn't be good, due to Nolan's abject seriousness and the movie's bloated length. I was wrong about that; even though I don't subscribe to the 'It's a masterpiece!' school, I must admit that it's much better than average blockbuster fare.
Next, I said the movie could never be a record breaker. I figured it would outdo the original, but still settle in well south of 300 million. Now the film sits at the #2 spot on the all-time charts. I could bust out inflation, I could talk about how the new theatrical paradigm is such that we might see this sucker eclipsed in the next year or two, but what matters is that I was very, very wrong about how much The Dark Knight could earn.
Lastly, I dismissed all talk of Oscars. I accepted a possible 'Sorry about being dead, guy' nom for Heath Ledger, but that was about as far as I was willing to go with it. And while I obviously haven't been proven wrong yet, things don't look good for me. What's ended up happening is that The Dark Knight has found itself at the center of a perfect storm: a weak year for Oscar contenders, a dead star who turned in a legitimately great performance and a mandate from both the box office and the critical community. While still facing a major uphill climb, the fact that the movie made a mint while being well-respected by the snobby media elite gives Batman a serious shot at being the first superhero to get real Oscar consideration.
Warner Bros certainly believes there's a real chance. At the end of the year many studios will take out For Your Consideration ads for many films and actors that would make you scratch your head. It's part of the keeping the talent happy game, and the studios don't really put much muscle behind these campaigns - an obligatory ad in the trades and that's it. But the studio is spending on The Dark Knight, and I don't think they would be bothering if they didn't think it would pay off. Sure, the movie earned enough money to buy itself every single ad in Variety, but unless they're serious that would be nothing but fronting (which is something that happens in Hollywood all the time).
A lot can change between now and the nominations, but I think that The Dark Knight has a decent chance at taking one of the five Best Picture slots. My guess is that it takes a slot but that Christopher Nolan gets snubbed for Director; Heath Ledger gets a Best Supporting Actor and, from the looks of things right now, has a large chance of winning the award. The question, should The Dark Knight get a nomination, is whether the Academy can stomach giving an Oscar to a superhero movie. It'll make for an interesting Oscar night, at any rate.
First I said that the film wouldn't be good, due to Nolan's abject seriousness and the movie's bloated length. I was wrong about that; even though I don't subscribe to the 'It's a masterpiece!' school, I must admit that it's much better than average blockbuster fare.
Next, I said the movie could never be a record breaker. I figured it would outdo the original, but still settle in well south of 300 million. Now the film sits at the #2 spot on the all-time charts. I could bust out inflation, I could talk about how the new theatrical paradigm is such that we might see this sucker eclipsed in the next year or two, but what matters is that I was very, very wrong about how much The Dark Knight could earn.
Lastly, I dismissed all talk of Oscars. I accepted a possible 'Sorry about being dead, guy' nom for Heath Ledger, but that was about as far as I was willing to go with it. And while I obviously haven't been proven wrong yet, things don't look good for me. What's ended up happening is that The Dark Knight has found itself at the center of a perfect storm: a weak year for Oscar contenders, a dead star who turned in a legitimately great performance and a mandate from both the box office and the critical community. While still facing a major uphill climb, the fact that the movie made a mint while being well-respected by the snobby media elite gives Batman a serious shot at being the first superhero to get real Oscar consideration.
Warner Bros certainly believes there's a real chance. At the end of the year many studios will take out For Your Consideration ads for many films and actors that would make you scratch your head. It's part of the keeping the talent happy game, and the studios don't really put much muscle behind these campaigns - an obligatory ad in the trades and that's it. But the studio is spending on The Dark Knight, and I don't think they would be bothering if they didn't think it would pay off. Sure, the movie earned enough money to buy itself every single ad in Variety, but unless they're serious that would be nothing but fronting (which is something that happens in Hollywood all the time).
A lot can change between now and the nominations, but I think that The Dark Knight has a decent chance at taking one of the five Best Picture slots. My guess is that it takes a slot but that Christopher Nolan gets snubbed for Director; Heath Ledger gets a Best Supporting Actor and, from the looks of things right now, has a large chance of winning the award. The question, should The Dark Knight get a nomination, is whether the Academy can stomach giving an Oscar to a superhero movie. It'll make for an interesting Oscar night, at any rate.
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Comments
Comment #1 (Posted by Anthony)
I have a whole new respect for you now -
The "STOP SEEING BATMAN MORE THAN ONCE" article on opening week make me nauseous to the point where I legitimately wanted to stop reading CHUD. I have since thought of you as an ignorant snob.
But I'm glad you came around!
Good man.
Comment #2 (Posted by Devin)
I didn't come around. I still think the people who saw the movie nine times in a weekend are sad. TDK won't be on my top ten list at the end of the year.
Comment #3 (Posted by Frogger)
So now it's nine? Wasn't it originally 2-3? How many times did you see Hellboy 2 in theaters?
Comment #4 (Posted by Soup)
The Oscars are corrupted anyway. Once venerable, now forgettable. I'm with you Devin on "It was Good but it wasn't THAT Good" as far as TDK goes. Heath would deserve recognition alive OR dead but the rest of the movie was a letdown when compared to the nonstop Hyperbole. I honestly could give a shit about the Oscars. It's all campaigns, lobbyists, and power-plays and I had enough of that shit this year.
Comment #5 (Posted by Devin)
Frogger: Twice. Once in rough form without finished FX and once completed a month later at the premiere. Not over a weekend. I'm sure you'd love to trip me up, but you'll have to resort to spitting on the pizza you deliver to my house.
Comment #6 (Posted by SgtZim)
If they gave best picture to 'Return of the King', a fantasy film, I see no reason why they wouldn't consider nominating a superhero film like 'Dark Knight'. It's one of those rare movies that made boatloads of cash and people won't regret its nomination (or possible win) years from now. Unlike Titanic, which I can barely stomach now, but enjoyed at the time.
Comment #7 (Posted by ManfromKazan)
Really, Devin? Not even top 10? At a certain point you're just being stubborn. There are films coming out soon that are likely better than TDK (Benjamin Button, for one), but the year has been so weak that even at your most stubborn, you have to give credit where credit is due. If you could name 5 or 6 movies from the year to date that are better than TDK, I'd be surprised. Maybe Rambo. Maybe.
Comment #8 (Posted by Chief O' Hara)
It takes a big man to admit that he's wrong, particularly when said self-anointed big man devotes entire columns to telling people how right he is.
Comment #9 (Posted by Random McAhole)
The Oscars don't really mean much to me these days. I used to care before Titanic and Galdiator(great action flick but who are we kidding here) won. But those for some reason were the wake up call that maybe this whole best picture thing is arbitrary. That trickles down to the acting categories. Nowadays, I could give a damn if a performance I love won the actor a little naked gold man. I'm disappointed Winslet still gives a damn.
Comment #10 (Posted by drewlicious)
It's a masterpiece I say. A masterpiece. Dark Knight is a strong film for any year and to say that this is a weak year for Oscar contenders is a tad presumptious. There are some spectacular films on the horizon: Milk, The Wrestler, Gran Torino, Frost/Nixon, and Slumdog Millionaire. We've already seen a couple of other strong films such as Wall-E and some frickin funny comedies like Forgetting Sarah Marshall and Tropic Thunder. Come on, that's some strong work. The Dark Knight would be brilliant even if I despised comic book movies and I can scarcely think of anything I've seen this year (or last year for that matter) that's as cinematically satisfying.
Comment #11 (Posted by the_salt_pork_is_particularly_good)
Meh... TDK was ok... but it was definately no "Twilight"!!!
Comment #12 (Posted by BusBoy)
Who says the Academy will see The Dark Knight as a superhero film? While it is undeniably that, it is also a cut far above others of the genre and works in other genre parameters. I think many of them will see simply it for what it is; as a great movie.
Comment #13 (Posted by Bill Brasky)
ManFromKazan: How about Iron Man, In Bruges, The Wackness, Tropic Thunder, Appaloosa, Slumdog Millionaire and the upcoming films Milk and The Wrestler (both deserve spots on a top 10 list) It's not really unbelievable that TDK wouldn't make Devin's list, and it has little to do with being stubborn.
Comment #14 (Posted by Jeb)
Just out of curiosity, when was the last posthumous Oscar awarded (outside of a technical category)? I know the Academy prefers to reward folks that they think have a decent chance of showing up to get the thing.
Comment #15 (Posted by devildoubt)
hmmm...11 comments and no one's called Devin fat yet. Maybe this place is changing.
Comment #16 (Posted by an unknown user)
You people are insane. Masterpiece? On what level? KFC Masterpiece level?
It was good as far as super hero movies go. And super hero movies are fucking awful, so that means nothing. It's about a guy in a big rubber bat suit fighting a clown. Go watch some real movies and forget about the Oscars, that's worthless junk and it always has been. It's all about money, even for Christopher Nolan. America's (and subsequently many parts of the world)'s views on film have become so twisted and stupid that we're mezmerized by silly action movies.
Comment #17 (Posted by bpvalentine)
I didn't love the Dark Knight tho I liked it. All the same, this thing has its own momentum. And I think Oscar voter vote as much along the lines of what they feel is in the air as much as what they actually liked. So while I don't think it'll score a lot of wins, I think it'll be recognized in many nominations.
Comment #18 (Posted by Batmantis)
A weak year for Oscar contenders yet The Dark Knight won't make his top ten list.
Please explain the grudge you have against this film.
And yes 'unknown user', a masterpiece.
Comment #19 (Posted by Dmn)
So Devin thinks it will get a best picture nod, Nolan will be overlooked, and Ledger could win best supporting actor. Based on past track record I guess that means Nolan is about to get an oscar, and Heath and the movie will be shut out.
Comment #20 (Posted by Random McAhole)
I just watched it the other night for the 2nd time. I liked it more this time. Thought it was great the first time, but I was also sitting there on opening night in cloud of hype. I'll put it in the bin with Gladiator, great action movie, but shouldn't be nominated for best picture. So with that track record it'll likely go all the way and make me less inclined to watch more.
Comment #21 (Posted by reduced20)
Tripping you up is unnecessary for proving you're wrong. There is nothing wrong with partaking of an activity more than once, even in a weekend, that brings you a measure of enjoyment. I didn't see the Dark Knight opening night, but I did see it that weekend and the following one as well. Then a couple weeks later I saw it in Imax. Why did I go see it so many times, the same reason I keep listening to a favorite record, rereading a book that love, and keep fucking my girlfriend, because I ENJOY it. Thats it. Is your argument that when we find something we enjoy, we should only experience it once? You seem to enjoy belittling peoples enjoyments, and you do it quite often, maybe its time YOU stopped.
Comment #22 (Posted by PaddyC)
Well done, Devin. It does take a big man to admit he's wrong, not everyone would. Kudos.
I would have TDK in my top ten this year, but then I haven't been to the cinema this year as much as I'd like. Three of the best I've seen this year, in Ireland, came out last year in the USA - There Will Be Blood, No Country for Old Men, and Gone Baby Gone (a great, great film). Of the 2008 crop, In Bruges, Iron Man, Tropic Thunder were all good. The best thing I saw in theatres this year was the documentary, Man on Wire, about the 1974 tightrope walk across the Twin Towers. Awesome stuff.
What's in your top ten so far? And what are you looking forward to seeing in the rest of the year?
Comment #23 (Posted by Devin from the future)
I'll have my revenge on you, you'll see. *Flexes washboard abs*
Comment #24 (Posted by Never rub another man's rhubarb)
We'll see. I don't think TDK was a masterpiece either and as you're all too well aware, these batfilms are usually overrated online to ridiculous levels. the difference this time, is the movie actually deserves it, so I myself am torn over whether to believe the hype this time... well I honestly think Ledger did a great joker in a good movie, stole the show, and deserves any awards coming to him. As for best ever performance in movies? no.
Comment #25 (Posted by an unknown user)
I don't think it's an issue of best. performance. ever.
Comment #26 (Posted by an unknown user)
i agree with devin whole-heartedly on this one- dark knight was good, but it was FAR from a masterpiece (useless hong kong segment, poor choreographed action, excruciating "nicky katt comedy hour" during police chase, terrible two face make up, etc)...i think it inhabited the world it created very well and i think that it should be beside the point whether it is a comic book movie or not to the academy...ledger really does deserve a nomiation, however...
Comment #27 (Posted by BusBoy)
The last posthumous Oscar awarded (and only one, I think) was to Peter Finch for Network.
Comment #28 (Posted by Splatoon)
It'll be close between this and War Zone, but I predict Batman by a nose when the final award tally is reached.
Comment #29 (Posted by Knugen)
Although I find TDK to be good or even great (the bat vision or whatever was weird), giving an award to someone who's dead is a bit strange. He will be remembered anyway so there is no need to pass on the living ones. Unless everyone else sucks ass by comparison.
Oh and make the minimum age 18 or at least 15. Kids can't act worth shit - if they're good - it's because of the director. Case in point - Anna Paquin, Tatum O'Neil, Haley Joel Osment, Justin Henry etc
Comment #30 (Posted by Phil Connors)
Well, that was big of you Dev. Good on you.
Comment #31 (Posted by Gaz)
Bit of a half-hearted climbdown. You acknowledge the film made a fortune, but you could 'bust out inflation' ....?? Please. I didn't realise the economy had changed so much over the last few months that we can't take TDK's profit at face value. It made a fortune, deal with it.
I can't understand how anyone can ever say they're 'wrong' when it comes to a review on a movie website. You had an opinion; it's neither wrong nor right, it just is. Why has your opinion changed? It's obvious you haven't gone for repeat viewings, given your derision towards those who would dare see the film more than twice, so thats not the reason. Is it possible your original post was just written as a pedantic bitchfest, exploring the musings of someone who simply doesn't get The Dark Knight and wanted all his fanboys to favour his top ten films instead?
Bring back film reviewers who can actually recognise quality for what it is - regardless of their personal preferences towards the genre, director, or whatever - and won't criticise the very same people who keep their website running for daring to see a movie they enjoy more than once.
Comment #32 (Posted by Frogger)
Ah, yes--I knew your name was familiar. You get the two large with cottage cheese and white onions? And then you feed it to your snapping mother and cry?
Comment #33 (Posted by an unknown user)
OLD NEWS
Comment #34 (Posted by Mr. Gittes)
Devin, do you still feel that Christian Bale is - what term did you say? - not a big deal?
He's got Terminator and Public Enemies coming up, plus God knows what other big projects he'll be hired for.
Comment #35 (Posted by Johhny Walker Black)
TDK did nothing for me except show that Batman in a real world setting looks ridiculous standing next to normal people. I cringed when Batman was in the Police station. I expected one of the cops to say "really? We are supposed to take you seriously." Batman Begins was at least fun.
Comment #36 (Posted by anonymous jerk)
WHO CARES if devin doesn't love your BLOATED movie? U DO which is sad.
Comment #37 (Posted by Dre)
Did Bill Brasky actually say that Tropic Thunder was one of the better movies of the year?
Wow.
Iron Man was funny in it, that's about it.
Comment #38 (Posted by masterbrocksamson)
...and I thought MY jokes were funny...
Comment #39 (Posted by Mike G)
Gaz, RTFA. The inflation and theater paradigm arguments are valid ones having to do with the fact that even adjusting box office numbers for inflation doesn't give you a true, pure measure of a movie's relative success. That's why saying "Dark Knight is the second highest grossing movie of all time" doesn't mean a whole lot when we'll have a new one in a couple years, or if day and date digital downloads become standard or whatever crazy shit happens in the future.
Also, he didn't say his review was wrong. He said his pre-viewing impressions were wrong, as well as his financial forecast, and his predictions for Oscar buzz. All three of his original statements were perfectly reasonable at the time, but they just ended up being wrong. So c'mon man think before you comment.
--Devin Apologist
Comment #40 (Posted by BRENDOR)
Hating the TDK is the new in thing to do.
Comment #41 (Posted by Gwai Lo)
I would like to make a strenuous objection to the idea that this has been a weak year for good movies. Synecdoche, New York; Let the Right One In; Il Divo; Wall-E; I've Loved You So Long; The Class; JCVD; Standard Operating Procedure; Man on Wire; Sugar; The Signal; Revanche; Mongol; The Girl by the Lake; Pineapple Express; The Good, the Bad and the Weird; Encounters at the End of the World; The Necessities of Life; Waltz with Bashir; Transsiberian; Ballast, Hellboy II, Iron Man; Four Nights with Anna; Achilles and the Tortoise; Forgetting Sarah Marshall; Redbelt; W.; The Wackness; Circus Rosaire; The Possibility of an Island; Cloverfield; Roman Polanski: Wanted and Desired; Gonzo: The Life and Work of Hunter S. Thompson; In Bruges; Quantum of Solace; Recount; The Ruins; [REC]; Tokyo!; I Am Good; Burn After Reading; The Fall; Fifty Dead Men Walking; Gomorra.. to name a few. And I haven't even seen The Wrestler; The Argentine; Guerilla; The Curious Case of Benjamin Button; Changeling; Choke; Australia; Defiance; Frost/Nixon; Slumdog Millionaire; Gran Torino; Happy-Go-Lucky; Rachel Getting Married; Valkyrie; Vicky Cristina Barcelona; Appaloosa; Choke; Milk; Miracle at St. Anna; A Christmas Story or Doubt yet. To name a few. The Dark Knight will make my top 3 though, for sure.
Comment #42 (Posted by Joe)
I think that a movie I was in, called "Cannibal Campout, where saturdays campers become sundays lunch" should've won the Oscar and so should've Norbit.
If TDK (not the blank tape company) wins golden rod after those two I mentioned were passed over, I will cry foul and scream corruption!
Comment #43 (Posted by I'm Just Saying.)
The Dark Knight was the best picture of the year. Hands down. I'd bet that Nolan gets nominated, as he should. I also bet we hear some actual sequel news after the ceremony. But I mean... I fucking love Batman. It's too bad you don't, Devin, your loss I guess.
Comment #44 (Posted by devins small baby penis)
hi al, devins small wee-wee here. devin is telling a lie every day he dresses in his xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxl batman costume and jerks off he's getting fucked in the ass by nolan.
I hope he stops soon after this article. being so small it hurts being abused daily
Comment #45 (Posted by mike)
fuck devin
Comment #46 (Posted by Trust Me On This One)
ManfromKazan -
you should really watch Benjamin Button before you declare it better than Dark Knight.
Trust me on this one.
Comment #47 (Posted by DarkSparrow)
I watched tdk twice in the theaters and loved it each time, I honestly think that the movie is a masterpiece, Heath Ledger deserves recognition no matter if he were alive or passed.
I think its one of the best movies of the year.
If you like superhero movies this year there were three good ones and this one topped them all.
Comment #48 (Posted by Brad)
This is for Devin:
The people who saw The Dark Knight 9 times are sad? You are sad, with your unkempt, homeless man appearance - you probably haven't been laid in centuries - and you are just insecure. Just because you're ugly doesn't men you have to take it out on movie and Batman fans. Go get a life you loser!
Comment #49 (Posted by coco)
so what are your top ten? i expect a list of your top ten jan 1st. call it 10 movies that were better than TDK.
Comment #50 (Posted by Chud Apatow)
I see Devin all the time in Studio City, and he actually doesn't look like a hobo. Quite the opposite.
That being said, TDK was just another big summer movie in a long line of crowd pleasing summer movies. It was entertaining and had a good performance by it's villain, but it wasn't anything more than that. Oscar-worthy films should be about something more than a rubber suited guy grunting really hard while trying to stop a clown from blowing up tugboats.
Don't equate success with significance.
Comment #51 (Posted by Marty J)
Without Ledger the film would be very, very dull. A cop procedural filled with humourless characters. Yawn.
Comment #52 (Posted by Oirectine)
I heartily agree with Marty J. I found the film very tedious and boring, the only scenes I found myself paying attention to were ones with Ledger.
Comment #53 (Posted by Christian Bale loves your $$$ but thinks you stink)
Chud Aptow nailed it better than I could. Seriously, a movie about a guy who wears a bat costume and fights a clown.... seriously? I hope Christian Bale punches some sense into you, it worked on his mother and sister.
Comment #54 (Posted by messi)
Sorry Devin, but the scene where Batman beats the shit out of criminals in the parking garage with that music playing destroys any movie this year. The most badass thing ever.That alone should get a top 10 spot. It's just awesome to watch. You are a snob, because you want to appear elitist instead of truthful in the fact that the dark knight is more entertaining than any of the movies you will list in your top 10.
Comment #55 (Posted by arteq)
iron man was superior to tdk five ways from sunday, and neither were great movies... if the academy had any balls they'd give wall-e best picture and best actor...
Comment #56 (Posted by FART MASTER)
Devin is fat.
Comment #57 (Posted by Richard Wagner)
Apologetic? This film is still a B-grade beat'em up for 16-year old male children, Asperger adults and "ohmigodheslikesodreamy" 16-year old female children. Oh, and it's "dark" and "gritty". That is so highly impressive.
Comment #58 (Posted by Yet another Devin Backhander)
To the commenter above - If you went to see TDK and only saw a rubber bat beating up a clown, then you're a fucking idiot...and what were you doing going to see a Batman film for anyway? At the very least it's going to be about a dude who dresses up like a Bat! Get with the program numbnuts!
Comment #59 (Posted by Rotten666)
God this thread is dumb.
Way to man up Devin. Cheers. And the inflation argument is legitimate. Gone with the wind made almost 1.5 billion in todays dollars; making it a wee bit more of a phenomenon than the dark knight.
I really enjoyed the movie, although the third act seemed a bit clunky to me.
@57 Really dude? Grow the fuck up.
Comment #60 (Posted by Ben Dover)
What is with everybody bashing on popular movies? I still don't understand the mindset of 'critics' and fans who visit these sites that need to freak out because TDK, or other films are well liked and received by the masses. Or didn't live up to expectations. Obviously TDK lived up to plenty of peoples' expectations or else it wouldn't be such a hit.
The nitpicking by 'movie fans' on these movie sites is incredible and kind of defeats the purpose of going to the movies in the first place.....
Comment #61 (Posted by Nac Dasty)
My parents were killed so I am going to dress like a bat and talk like I zipped up my penis. And check out my butler, he looks like that dude in Jaws The Revenge.
Comment #62 (Posted by stupid kiddie horror fan.)
Not dead, no oscar nom. Fucking deal with it. Where's RDJ's lead nom for IM? better than death ledger's scenery chewing.
Comment #63 (Posted by Gary Thompson)
So the Dark knight won't make Devin's top 10, but Pineapple Express will...interesting. I guess everyone has an opinion, but that one baffles me a bit.
Comment #64 (Posted by Josh)
Ugh. Batman is not a "super" hero ffs. Really what is different about the shit Batman pulls off in these movies and the stuff George Clooney and Brad Pitt do in the Ocean's 1* movies? Also: this movie is not a masterpiece any more than Titanic was. Good flicks but not even the best of their respective years. Really all they did was illustrate how completely fucking random the zeitgeist is. But hey I like Batman as a character and I like this take on him, even if I did like BB better than TDK. Which is ironic as I had about as many problems with BB as Devin did. Though it should be commended for featuring Eric Roberts and surviving. All that said I do hope Ledger gets the Oscar. He's always been solid and it's genuinely sad he died just before being truly great. Seriously, I can think of friend's deaths that bum me out less than Ledger's.

